The closest thing to a 90s style affordable but good sit down meal I can reliably find in the US is from Mexican restaurants. The best ones are still locally owned and have lots of work trucks parked in the lot during lunch. These places are absolutely delicious and often cheaper than fast food.
Here in Berlin fast food chains are for the tourists. You pay way too much for crappy food. If you know where to go, you can sit down for a proper meal and pay far less.
There are about 40 Mc Donald's restaurants in Berlin. About 1 per 100K citizens. There are a few other chains operating of course but they are similarly small. There are 4000 kebab restaurants in Berlin. And loads of pizza, pasta, currywurst, sushi, etc. restaurants too. Probably close to 10K restaurants or so. The vast majority of which are not franchises. It's great.
Germany just seems to have a lot of rules that prevent franchising from being very lucrative. Whatever it is, I love it. I'm from the Netherlands. That's more like the US. Restaurants are expensive. Sitting down for a quick, affordable lunch is not much of a thing. It's either cheap fast food or self-catering in the super market/bakery. With all the health consequences as well. Obesity is on the rise and it's a poverty correlated thing. Food poverty means lots of fast food.
Franchise is modern slavery. Not the first and the last one ended up in totally bankrupty.
The chains know what they are doing and using such people as guinea pig for market research. They testing the waters if such a restaurant will make profit, if not, only a poor former owner will sue them, if he has money, energy and time for it..
They close that venue, picking up their machines and the owner is from now on without money.
Self-employed people dont receive welfare benefits, nothing. Even if they have worked as employees before and paid taxes and insurances.
Its suicide to run a business without money in the background.
Not recommendable for unemployed, desperate and older workers.
What are some of your favourite places to eat out in Berlin? I wouldn’t call the Döner places a kebab restaurant by the way, but maybe that’s being picky
The article and the analyses in it seem to have overlooked a couple of things:
- Decline in quality of food: As far as I know, pan pizza in the 90s at Pizza Hut (that the article talks about) had the dough made in house; modern versions have reheated frozen dough. I feel like this is an important distinction. If I'm just reheating frozen pizza, I can do that at home.
- Decline in quality of service: The article mentions this in passing (server knowing the order of a frequent customer) but doesn't go any deeper. In my experience, a lot of the servers (not just at chains, but everywhere) these days are younger people who seem pretty indifferent to the customer experience. Certainly I don't think that any servers at a Pizza Hut will remember someone's order in 2025.
The factors I mention above are hard to measure, especially over time. But I do feel like they have contributed to the decline of chains to some degree as well as things like orders to go, did delivery apps, etc.
I honestly think this is a big one. I love restaurants and love going out to eat, but the number of restaurants I feel I want to go to just keeps declining. Places I used to love and go to weekly, I don't visit any more because the food just isn't good. I'm honestly having a hard time remembering the last time a new place blew me away. Combine that with rapidly rising food prices, and it's just not fun any more. Going out dropping $50+ and leaving slightly disappointed, is just depressing.
It doesn't stop there. Many of the big chain sit-down restaurants do little more than reheat pre-prepared items. You are basically getting airplane dinners. Its all centralized, mass produced, and cost-optimized.
And I'm skeptical it's actually cost-optimized. I think it's effort-optimized. The owner doesn't have to supervise reheating pre-prepared meals that are microwaved. I guess that's another form of cost-optimized, but it just feels like most restaurants don't have anyone in charge with any incentive to care.
One type of restaurant that would be a great import into the U.S: The "comida corrida" places of where I live in Mexico. Basically, they're tiny, family-run sit-down joints with simple setup (sometimes being run right in the lower floor of someone's home or in their garage, repurposed with a kitchen addition) and simple but essentially home cooked and balanced fare. For the equivalent of 3 to 7 dollars, you get a starter, main course and desert for lunch (in some cases they also serve breakfast) The food isn't fancy, but it's freshly made and filling.
There are some small Mexican restaurants like that here in the US. I often eat lunch at a small nearby Mexican restaurant and pay around $8 for my meal.
I think it depends where you are. Other than airports (with "fast casual" burgers), I don't eat at midrange/low-midrange chains but that isn't really an option everywhere.
To write something shorter than the sibling comment: A lot of people just don't care that much and want something predictable. To another thread that was going on in a post yesterday or so, I'm not like that with restaurants but I often am with hotel rooms (though the middle-tier business hotels are still probably a few hundred dollars a night in large cities).
I suspect the reason is consistency. For the most part, getting something at a large chain is going to be pretty similar over time regardless of the location, so if you're really in the mood for something specific, it can be easier to go with a known quantity even if the overall quality is very mid. My wife and I have a bit of an in-joke every time we try a new restaurant about getting French fries because I tend to strongly prefer fries that are crispy, whereas she enjoys fries that are more "soft" as long as they're not soggy (like steak fries, crinkle fries, etc.) office times seeing fries on a menu doesn't make it at all clear what exactly you're getting, so probably at least half the time I end up just giving her fries that I order because they end up not being what I'm looking for. Getting fries from McDonald's or Wendy's or something isn't going to end up with you having the best fries you've ever tasted, but you know exactly what you're getting at least compared to a small individual restaurant, and for those of us with very specific preferences, it's just easier sometimes.
Even though this is a bit tangential (and not something you're calling out here), I'll also add that having struggled with being picky with things that are ostensibly the type of foods that picky eaters enjoy like fries has led to me to absolutely loath having to ask for details about stuff in restaurants. It probably doesn't help that I'm also on the spectrum and have suffered from social anxiety a lot over the years, but I'll never understand why so many people feel so entitled to demand explanations about why I don't like certain foods or ways that they're prepared when it doesn't affect them at all. It's not like I _want_ so many foods to taste worse to me than others, and yes I'm sure that with the right amount of effort and diligence I probably would eventually be able to get past most of it, but I don't see why that means that acquaintances or coworkers I'm not particularly close would think it's reasonable to interrogate me about it; if anything, having to try to explain myself makes it _more_ stressful and reduces the emotional energy I have to try to change things! Back when I worked in an office, I sometimes would literally try to time my lunch break to when nobody else would be in the cafeteria because so many people over the years would try to get me to explain why I would eat get food from the same restaurant multiple days in a row, and I got to the point where I would have anxiety about eating in front of other people. This isn't even touching on stuff like how hard it seems to be for some restaurants to follow what I'd consider to be very basic instructions (like "don't put mayonnaise on this sandwich" and how often times the "default" way something will be served will contain extra condiments or toppings that weren't even listed on the menu, and trying to deal with that just adds to the stress given how often times asking for the issue to be just leads to frustration on both sides. My point is that sometimes the choice of what to eat isn't just a choice of how to ingest calories but has social implications as well, and I think that attitudes like "I don't understand why people do this" can end up just reinforcing trends where some people will value consistency. If I'm hungry and just want to eat and get back to whatever I was doing beforehand, sometimes I'm just going to want to know exactly what I'm gonna be dealing with in advance, and unless I happen to already have spent the time to try out enough places to know what I like in the area, a national chain is a way for me to be reasonably confident about that.
Sure. But people here are talking about frequenting chains in their hometown. If national chains are the best options in your local area, it's a sign you need to move to a better area.
People live in a given area for lots of reasons that may not include restaurant selection. I rarely eat out around my house—though there are a few restaurants that are better than national chains
I live in a pretty sleepy farm type area, with a growing town in the middle. There are most of the main restaurant attractions. My wife and I are always amazed as we drive by the back to back Chili's, Outback and Texas RoadHouse., that are bustling at the seams, the parking lots are very often overflowing. We are amazed that there still are apparently plenty of people who can frequent these places.
So i can fully imagine that this article has it right, i just don't see it where i live.
I wish the concept of a milk bar would spread to America from Central/Eastern Europe. They are essentially a mix of an American diner and a cafeteria, where you can get cheap, good food that is already cooked (with a few exceptions like pierogi.) Think Chipotle but with local specialities and with an 80s communist-era vibe. It is usually fast but is much healthier than typical fast food chains.
Milk bars were started during the communist era and are still popular amongst the older (70+) crowd, but modern versions are a go-to for younger people too. And so you'll usually get a very interesting mix of society sitting side-by-side. Not quite a family dinner restaurant, but is a social restaurant concept nonetheless.
> Where Will We Eat When the Middle-Class Restaurant Is Gone?
I currently live in a suburb outside a small city with a family of 5. I gues when the middle-class restaurant is gone I'm going to be eating exactly where I have been eating the last 10, 15 years: at home.
Yes, let's mention the middle class squeeze, but also conveniently not talk about America's tipping culture problem which would increase reluctance to sit down at a restaurant. Yes, let's completely ignore that.
Everyone obviously wants to pay extra so they can be constantly badgered and rushed out the door like cattle, and if you complain about any aspect of this, the white knights come out to drown you as they say it's your fault for not understanding the plight of the woe-is-me restaurant worker and there's absolutely nothing to be done other than shame you into not going out to eat.
You know that there's actual, indepently owned, restaurants that are way better than these
Sure, sometimes. But honestly I find that this is rarely the case. The same economic pressures exist for the small independent restaurants as well, and they need to use the same 'tricks' to keep costs down. My 'favorite' reasonably price local place in my neighbourhood is a lovely place to go, nice vibe, often has live music and is run by nice people, but I'd be lying if I said the food was fantastic.
Don’t most of the chain restaurants serve essentially factory made food that is rehabilitated in the kitchen? Whereas I think most fancy restaurants I go to make the food from scratch. The latter seems better to me in theory, so I wonder if I value “made from scratch” more than you? Fancy restaurant food tends to have much more nuance and depth of flavor IME. Of course this doesn’t hold 100% of the time, I’ve certainly had bad food from expensive restaurants before.
Take a closer look how often the waiters change/quit. In the beginning phase of such a restaurant, all is nice and well.
For the google-recension. Then, price will rise and service will get worse.
Even high priced restaurants serve dwarf-sized dishes, 2 potatoes and a tiny slice of meat. The wine maybe expensive, but isnt it just grape juice?
Also, the food industry is very creative to produce stuff that looks like home-made, at a cheap price.
Or the recycling approach. Put sugar on your potatoes and let the dish half finished go back.
Wait for the next customers complain about "sweet potatoes".
My two cents from over the pond. Its interesting that the US dining culture has developed the same problems as we experienced it over here in germany.
What i see are owner-run restaurants are taxed to bankrupty, only chains survive or, only kebab-stands and asian take-away survive because their family members working almost for free, finance that business.
I once was on a trip in vienna, austria. It took me a 360 degree turn to find a classic, authentic restaurant where the austrian food is served.
Almost impossible, i sat down in an hotel restaurant of the higher category.
Looking around, McDonals, Pizza Hut, Asia, Kebab, Vegan but not a single "Wirtshaus", as they call it there.
Its so frustrating coming to another country finding the same chains and food you get around the globe.
In my hometown Augsburg, Germany, i once went out for a breakfast.
Usually we walk to the bakery, order some kaiser rolls, Brezn(Pretzels..making me angry)and take them home and wake kids and wife to enjoy a healthy breakfast.
Some bakerys offer tables and coffee to spend time there.
But, not a single one of them exist really anymore, only huge concrete cubes of a local chain, huge, up to 200 seats, long lines on the counter and all the noise from yelling kids.
Expensive is the other problem they are.
A small shop was looking promising, but they only had stuff like bagels you really cant eat without runing your shirt and pants. Looking all nice and prepared sitting hours in the counter.
Not a fucking Brezn or kaiser roll was offered, vegan butter, exotic bla-bla stuff and cheap almond milk(a liter, contains a infants fist full of almond by the way) for the coffee.
The loud music was also annoying.
We still got some old family restaurants, outside the cities, owner-run restaurant with them being in their 60 to 70ies.
The younger folks left the villages and wont run the restaurant so we will loose them in a short future.
Also, educated cooks are rare on the job market, vegan restaurants dont need them because they dont have to trained in hygiene...They only warm up pre-fabricated stuff.
Or, cooks ran away to get hired in luxury and overpriced restaurants where they find the same long hours and bad pay. But its better for the vita having worked in $Restaurants.
I don't know about the US or Germany but in the UK a frequent complaint is landlords extracting their pound of flesh. An owner-run restaurant or even retail outlet has very little negotiating power against these people. Anything they do to increase trade gets mopped up at the next rent review.
> Americans are spending money at restaurants as much as ever — but really, they are buying food made by a restaurant and eating it somewhere else. Takeout and delivery apps are now ingrained habits. Drive-throughs are going strong. Random snacks and little treats are obsolescing breakfast, lunch and dinner, according to multiple analysts.
I admittedly lost the patience to sit there and wait instead of doing something else, having the food delivered, and immediately eating upon starting the process.
Eating at a restaurant seems like a subpar experience now compared to my own table.
It isn’t just me. Everyone from my grandparents to my friend groups is increasingly takeout and delivery driven.
> Eating at a restaurant seems like a subpar experience now compared to my own table.
Also most midrange restaurants I have been to lately are just so _loud_. Not sure if it is all the hard surfaces that are so popular, or if people just have less social awareness anymore and yap away at such high volumes.
Seems wild. I’d rather just make something at home, hit up a good food truck, or go somewhere fancy.
Look how many people wear headphones nowadays. Many of them at high volumes.
Try to watch a movie and to listen to conversations in that movie.
I am constantly using the remote to turn down loud explosions and amp up the very silent speakers.
Its a problem of the studios and movie makers, not everybody has or wants a 7.1 sound system.
The younger generation also is more short-sighted than ever. Smartphone and screen time is increasing.
Also, loud music increases thirst, which is good for the owner. Another aspect is waking the fight mode in humans so the waiters are more vigilant after their night out the day before...
Most of them are young uni students, earning some cash for partying.
I agree it seems the whole middle part of the of restaurant market is terrible. I can think of several places where I'm happy to pay $15-20 for a meal and several places where I'm happy to pay $100+, but hardly anywhere in the $30-40 range where I feel I'm getting value for money.
It's also loud because everyone is playing sound out of their device speakers, especially young parents who set up mini tablet theaters as soon as they sit down at the table. I don't understand why restaurants allow it. Why would I pay more for that ambiance?
All of the above. Most importantly, restaurant owners associate quiet with old and dead restaurants so they deliberately make things loud. They play music at loud levels which requires people to raise their voice. They prefer the look of hard surfaces and its certainly cheaper to leave wood, brick, and concrete exposed than to cover them up with material. Tablecloths impose ongoing costs and may not be in line with the ambiance the owners are going for.
For the restaurants mentioned in the article, I fully agree. Especially because you're not losing much quality. A pizza hut pizza will be just as bad at a pizza hut as it will be 15 minutes later at home or in a park. The same goes for the mostly deep fried or microwaved food at Applebee's or a Wing Joint.
But I will still opt to eat in at nicer establishments, where I'm paying for quality and don't want to suffer any lose of it. A nice plus is they usually have a nice atmosphere and a selection of cocktails/cocktails that I wouldn't make at home.
So we are talking about cheap chains, not middle class places. These are just slightly glorified fast food.
In Europe, apart from TGI Fridays, they were never a thing. And they were seen as just simply fast food. If they vanished, few people will mention.
If these are middle class they are for well, "statistical middle", i.e. working poor.
Proper restaurants should be small businesses and family owned and grow their client base over generations, then they are pretty much bulletproof against all kinds of economic hardships.
A lot of them have started to directly compete against fast food. Applebees for instance offers a deal that's about the same price as a McDonalds meal.
> In Europe, apart from TGI Fridays, they were never a thing. And they were seen as just simply fast food.
The discussion and the article is US specific, but as general point 'Europe' is a big generalization akin to 'Africa' or 'Asia'.
These places are too heterogenous for blanket statements.
As a point of anecdata between around the 1960's and early 2000's in most mediterranean countries, middle class would indeed sit down for lunch in nearby restaurants for an affordable lunch. Many of these places would serves as cafes during the day and affordable bistro at lunch.
Most either ramped up prices or went bust.
It is either grab a coffee and go or white cloth restaurant prices. The middle ground business model has indeed vanished or really downgraded their offering, in most countries around the mediterranean.
In Europe, apart from TGI Fridays, they were never a thing. And they were seen as just simply fast food.
I remember when the first TGI Fridays opened in my country (early 90s) and it was definitely seen as a pretty fancy 'foreign' restaurant, the sort of place you could definitely fo for special occasions or to celebrate something.
I think the difference is that Americans expect to be able to eat out several days a week. This means that an American middle-class restaurant must be cheaper than a European middle-class restaurant, which you go to once a month.
yeah, having grown up outside the US I kept wondering why exactly there aren't local, independent restaurants in that price point. do the economics just not work out over here due to disproportionately higher rent and labour costs?
I think it depends where you are. When I worked in Boston, going to somewhere like Chinatown was common. No one I knew would have gone to a chain restaurant for lunch.
true in the SF bay area too, but reading the article made me think that was an aberration. maybe the mom and pop restaurants only survive in big cities. or maybe the article was just over focused on the chains and ignoring the smaller restaurants.
I think it depends. I live in basically an exurban area about 50 miles west of Boston. I'm not sure I'd say there are a huge number of places, but there is definitely a decent population of local midrange restaurants.
Certainly you get into a more geuinely rural area and your options of all sorts shrink.
My bet is it that's due to people's obsession with brands. They just see "noname" thing as inherently less valuable than a branded one, so family-owned places stay invisible, looked down upon.
> These are just slightly glorified fast food. In Europe,
In my opinion it's a drinking culture thing. These places also served alcohol which is more tightly distributed than it would be in Europe. There's less of a reason for them to exist there.
I also think that's the reason for their decline. The day drinking crowd simply aged out of the business lunch segment. It was inevitable. COVID probably accelerated it some but the writing was on the wall.
> Proper restaurants
Yea, which is why I think it's about the drinks, these restaurants all used a common major supplier (Sysco) that makes restaurant ready foods that are mostly just microwave and serve. It was never about the quality of the food.
In some parts of Europe. In other parts it is very much frowned upon. Then there is the generational shift, even in countries where it used to be the norm to drink at lunch, people under 30-40 just aren't drinking like that any more, and might very well frown upon people that do.
It used to be more common in the US. The “two martini lunch” was a staple. Today, I can’t remember the last time I had alcohol at lunch in a work setting.
Why? Their lives seem to be also a lot more useless than those of previous generations. Why care about them and not allow oneself little pleasures? As if some great achievements were waiting for them with only booze getting in the way.
Is it just simply because they are a lot more neurotic because of all that shit on the internet?
https://archive.li/txzjr
The closest thing to a 90s style affordable but good sit down meal I can reliably find in the US is from Mexican restaurants. The best ones are still locally owned and have lots of work trucks parked in the lot during lunch. These places are absolutely delicious and often cheaper than fast food.
Here in Berlin fast food chains are for the tourists. You pay way too much for crappy food. If you know where to go, you can sit down for a proper meal and pay far less.
There are about 40 Mc Donald's restaurants in Berlin. About 1 per 100K citizens. There are a few other chains operating of course but they are similarly small. There are 4000 kebab restaurants in Berlin. And loads of pizza, pasta, currywurst, sushi, etc. restaurants too. Probably close to 10K restaurants or so. The vast majority of which are not franchises. It's great.
Germany just seems to have a lot of rules that prevent franchising from being very lucrative. Whatever it is, I love it. I'm from the Netherlands. That's more like the US. Restaurants are expensive. Sitting down for a quick, affordable lunch is not much of a thing. It's either cheap fast food or self-catering in the super market/bakery. With all the health consequences as well. Obesity is on the rise and it's a poverty correlated thing. Food poverty means lots of fast food.
Franchise is modern slavery. Not the first and the last one ended up in totally bankrupty. The chains know what they are doing and using such people as guinea pig for market research. They testing the waters if such a restaurant will make profit, if not, only a poor former owner will sue them, if he has money, energy and time for it.. They close that venue, picking up their machines and the owner is from now on without money. Self-employed people dont receive welfare benefits, nothing. Even if they have worked as employees before and paid taxes and insurances. Its suicide to run a business without money in the background. Not recommendable for unemployed, desperate and older workers.
What are some of your favourite places to eat out in Berlin? I wouldn’t call the Döner places a kebab restaurant by the way, but maybe that’s being picky
I went to a restaurant last Friday with my mother and it cost 70 euro. Not something I personally can afford to do very frequently.
However thanks to the excellent Dutch pension system there is a boomer class that has lots of money keeping the economy afloat.
Ignore the colonized youth with no hope and no future , in the boomer empire the sun never sets.
The article and the analyses in it seem to have overlooked a couple of things:
- Decline in quality of food: As far as I know, pan pizza in the 90s at Pizza Hut (that the article talks about) had the dough made in house; modern versions have reheated frozen dough. I feel like this is an important distinction. If I'm just reheating frozen pizza, I can do that at home.
- Decline in quality of service: The article mentions this in passing (server knowing the order of a frequent customer) but doesn't go any deeper. In my experience, a lot of the servers (not just at chains, but everywhere) these days are younger people who seem pretty indifferent to the customer experience. Certainly I don't think that any servers at a Pizza Hut will remember someone's order in 2025.
The factors I mention above are hard to measure, especially over time. But I do feel like they have contributed to the decline of chains to some degree as well as things like orders to go, did delivery apps, etc.
Decline in quality of food
I honestly think this is a big one. I love restaurants and love going out to eat, but the number of restaurants I feel I want to go to just keeps declining. Places I used to love and go to weekly, I don't visit any more because the food just isn't good. I'm honestly having a hard time remembering the last time a new place blew me away. Combine that with rapidly rising food prices, and it's just not fun any more. Going out dropping $50+ and leaving slightly disappointed, is just depressing.
> reheated frozen dough
It doesn't stop there. Many of the big chain sit-down restaurants do little more than reheat pre-prepared items. You are basically getting airplane dinners. Its all centralized, mass produced, and cost-optimized.
And I'm skeptical it's actually cost-optimized. I think it's effort-optimized. The owner doesn't have to supervise reheating pre-prepared meals that are microwaved. I guess that's another form of cost-optimized, but it just feels like most restaurants don't have anyone in charge with any incentive to care.
Care costs money though right? Isn’t that cost optimization with extra steps?
One type of restaurant that would be a great import into the U.S: The "comida corrida" places of where I live in Mexico. Basically, they're tiny, family-run sit-down joints with simple setup (sometimes being run right in the lower floor of someone's home or in their garage, repurposed with a kitchen addition) and simple but essentially home cooked and balanced fare. For the equivalent of 3 to 7 dollars, you get a starter, main course and desert for lunch (in some cases they also serve breakfast) The food isn't fancy, but it's freshly made and filling.
There are some small Mexican restaurants like that here in the US. I often eat lunch at a small nearby Mexican restaurant and pay around $8 for my meal.
Are these types of restaurants actually going away or are crappy chains just going under because better alternatives are a dime a dozen?
I think it depends where you are. Other than airports (with "fast casual" burgers), I don't eat at midrange/low-midrange chains but that isn't really an option everywhere.
To your point, I can't remember the last time I've eaten at a national chain outside of airports. I don't understand why people do this.
To write something shorter than the sibling comment: A lot of people just don't care that much and want something predictable. To another thread that was going on in a post yesterday or so, I'm not like that with restaurants but I often am with hotel rooms (though the middle-tier business hotels are still probably a few hundred dollars a night in large cities).
I don't understand why people do this.
If I'm in my small local town centre and want to grab a burger, the (slightly better) national chain is simply best burger on offer.
I suspect the reason is consistency. For the most part, getting something at a large chain is going to be pretty similar over time regardless of the location, so if you're really in the mood for something specific, it can be easier to go with a known quantity even if the overall quality is very mid. My wife and I have a bit of an in-joke every time we try a new restaurant about getting French fries because I tend to strongly prefer fries that are crispy, whereas she enjoys fries that are more "soft" as long as they're not soggy (like steak fries, crinkle fries, etc.) office times seeing fries on a menu doesn't make it at all clear what exactly you're getting, so probably at least half the time I end up just giving her fries that I order because they end up not being what I'm looking for. Getting fries from McDonald's or Wendy's or something isn't going to end up with you having the best fries you've ever tasted, but you know exactly what you're getting at least compared to a small individual restaurant, and for those of us with very specific preferences, it's just easier sometimes.
Even though this is a bit tangential (and not something you're calling out here), I'll also add that having struggled with being picky with things that are ostensibly the type of foods that picky eaters enjoy like fries has led to me to absolutely loath having to ask for details about stuff in restaurants. It probably doesn't help that I'm also on the spectrum and have suffered from social anxiety a lot over the years, but I'll never understand why so many people feel so entitled to demand explanations about why I don't like certain foods or ways that they're prepared when it doesn't affect them at all. It's not like I _want_ so many foods to taste worse to me than others, and yes I'm sure that with the right amount of effort and diligence I probably would eventually be able to get past most of it, but I don't see why that means that acquaintances or coworkers I'm not particularly close would think it's reasonable to interrogate me about it; if anything, having to try to explain myself makes it _more_ stressful and reduces the emotional energy I have to try to change things! Back when I worked in an office, I sometimes would literally try to time my lunch break to when nobody else would be in the cafeteria because so many people over the years would try to get me to explain why I would eat get food from the same restaurant multiple days in a row, and I got to the point where I would have anxiety about eating in front of other people. This isn't even touching on stuff like how hard it seems to be for some restaurants to follow what I'd consider to be very basic instructions (like "don't put mayonnaise on this sandwich" and how often times the "default" way something will be served will contain extra condiments or toppings that weren't even listed on the menu, and trying to deal with that just adds to the stress given how often times asking for the issue to be just leads to frustration on both sides. My point is that sometimes the choice of what to eat isn't just a choice of how to ingest calories but has social implications as well, and I think that attitudes like "I don't understand why people do this" can end up just reinforcing trends where some people will value consistency. If I'm hungry and just want to eat and get back to whatever I was doing beforehand, sometimes I'm just going to want to know exactly what I'm gonna be dealing with in advance, and unless I happen to already have spent the time to try out enough places to know what I like in the area, a national chain is a way for me to be reasonably confident about that.
Because when you are travelling odds on the toilets are clean
Sure. But people here are talking about frequenting chains in their hometown. If national chains are the best options in your local area, it's a sign you need to move to a better area.
People live in a given area for lots of reasons that may not include restaurant selection. I rarely eat out around my house—though there are a few restaurants that are better than national chains
I live in a pretty sleepy farm type area, with a growing town in the middle. There are most of the main restaurant attractions. My wife and I are always amazed as we drive by the back to back Chili's, Outback and Texas RoadHouse., that are bustling at the seams, the parking lots are very often overflowing. We are amazed that there still are apparently plenty of people who can frequent these places.
So i can fully imagine that this article has it right, i just don't see it where i live.
One of the benefits of the increase in fast food prices is that local burger places have become the better option.
I wish the concept of a milk bar would spread to America from Central/Eastern Europe. They are essentially a mix of an American diner and a cafeteria, where you can get cheap, good food that is already cooked (with a few exceptions like pierogi.) Think Chipotle but with local specialities and with an 80s communist-era vibe. It is usually fast but is much healthier than typical fast food chains.
Milk bars were started during the communist era and are still popular amongst the older (70+) crowd, but modern versions are a go-to for younger people too. And so you'll usually get a very interesting mix of society sitting side-by-side. Not quite a family dinner restaurant, but is a social restaurant concept nonetheless.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bar_mleczny
Oh we have that...a diner mixed with a cafeteria, minus the good/healthy food - Golden Corral
Not sure if you're joking, but if not: Golden Corral is very different from a milk bar.
Would you consider something like the Ikea cafeteria to be someways similar?
Yeah, that’s a good example. The newer milk bars have a similar vibe.
> Where Will We Eat When the Middle-Class Restaurant Is Gone?
I currently live in a suburb outside a small city with a family of 5. I gues when the middle-class restaurant is gone I'm going to be eating exactly where I have been eating the last 10, 15 years: at home.
Yes, let's mention the middle class squeeze, but also conveniently not talk about America's tipping culture problem which would increase reluctance to sit down at a restaurant. Yes, let's completely ignore that.
Everyone obviously wants to pay extra so they can be constantly badgered and rushed out the door like cattle, and if you complain about any aspect of this, the white knights come out to drown you as they say it's your fault for not understanding the plight of the woe-is-me restaurant worker and there's absolutely nothing to be done other than shame you into not going out to eat.
I wonder why sit-down restaurants are declining.
Do they really talk to you about it directly? Last thing I want is to feel guilty even going out to a meal
Perhaps. I read about horror stories of servers chasing leaving customers and harrassing them for not tipping or too little.
But of course GP was deliciously ironic, so take all with a grain of salt and a dash of black humor.
> I wonder why sit-down restaurants are declining.
Not because of tipping.
The rise of kiosk tip screens changes this. You are asked to tip someone behind a counter.
Tipping is not stopping a meaningful amount of people from going out.
I suppose it's because I grew up with it, but I greatly prefer food from these type of restaurants than from fancier more expensive restaurants.
You know that there's actual, indepently owned, restaurants that are way better than these thet aren't "more expensive", right?
I don't even know where the nearest applebees, chilis, etc is to me. I don't need to spend an arm & a leg to eat when dining out.
You know that there's actual, indepently owned, restaurants that are way better than these
Sure, sometimes. But honestly I find that this is rarely the case. The same economic pressures exist for the small independent restaurants as well, and they need to use the same 'tricks' to keep costs down. My 'favorite' reasonably price local place in my neighbourhood is a lovely place to go, nice vibe, often has live music and is run by nice people, but I'd be lying if I said the food was fantastic.
Don’t most of the chain restaurants serve essentially factory made food that is rehabilitated in the kitchen? Whereas I think most fancy restaurants I go to make the food from scratch. The latter seems better to me in theory, so I wonder if I value “made from scratch” more than you? Fancy restaurant food tends to have much more nuance and depth of flavor IME. Of course this doesn’t hold 100% of the time, I’ve certainly had bad food from expensive restaurants before.
Some do but wasn't always like that either. I really don't care for nuanced tastes, etc. at least when I'm hungry lol.
The fancier ones seem to have worse food, worse service, and are far more expensive.
Take a closer look how often the waiters change/quit. In the beginning phase of such a restaurant, all is nice and well. For the google-recension. Then, price will rise and service will get worse. Even high priced restaurants serve dwarf-sized dishes, 2 potatoes and a tiny slice of meat. The wine maybe expensive, but isnt it just grape juice? Also, the food industry is very creative to produce stuff that looks like home-made, at a cheap price. Or the recycling approach. Put sugar on your potatoes and let the dish half finished go back. Wait for the next customers complain about "sweet potatoes".
My two cents from over the pond. Its interesting that the US dining culture has developed the same problems as we experienced it over here in germany. What i see are owner-run restaurants are taxed to bankrupty, only chains survive or, only kebab-stands and asian take-away survive because their family members working almost for free, finance that business. I once was on a trip in vienna, austria. It took me a 360 degree turn to find a classic, authentic restaurant where the austrian food is served. Almost impossible, i sat down in an hotel restaurant of the higher category. Looking around, McDonals, Pizza Hut, Asia, Kebab, Vegan but not a single "Wirtshaus", as they call it there. Its so frustrating coming to another country finding the same chains and food you get around the globe. In my hometown Augsburg, Germany, i once went out for a breakfast. Usually we walk to the bakery, order some kaiser rolls, Brezn(Pretzels..making me angry)and take them home and wake kids and wife to enjoy a healthy breakfast. Some bakerys offer tables and coffee to spend time there. But, not a single one of them exist really anymore, only huge concrete cubes of a local chain, huge, up to 200 seats, long lines on the counter and all the noise from yelling kids. Expensive is the other problem they are. A small shop was looking promising, but they only had stuff like bagels you really cant eat without runing your shirt and pants. Looking all nice and prepared sitting hours in the counter. Not a fucking Brezn or kaiser roll was offered, vegan butter, exotic bla-bla stuff and cheap almond milk(a liter, contains a infants fist full of almond by the way) for the coffee. The loud music was also annoying. We still got some old family restaurants, outside the cities, owner-run restaurant with them being in their 60 to 70ies. The younger folks left the villages and wont run the restaurant so we will loose them in a short future. Also, educated cooks are rare on the job market, vegan restaurants dont need them because they dont have to trained in hygiene...They only warm up pre-fabricated stuff. Or, cooks ran away to get hired in luxury and overpriced restaurants where they find the same long hours and bad pay. But its better for the vita having worked in $Restaurants.
I don't know about the US or Germany but in the UK a frequent complaint is landlords extracting their pound of flesh. An owner-run restaurant or even retail outlet has very little negotiating power against these people. Anything they do to increase trade gets mopped up at the next rent review.
> Americans are spending money at restaurants as much as ever — but really, they are buying food made by a restaurant and eating it somewhere else. Takeout and delivery apps are now ingrained habits. Drive-throughs are going strong. Random snacks and little treats are obsolescing breakfast, lunch and dinner, according to multiple analysts.
I admittedly lost the patience to sit there and wait instead of doing something else, having the food delivered, and immediately eating upon starting the process.
Eating at a restaurant seems like a subpar experience now compared to my own table.
It isn’t just me. Everyone from my grandparents to my friend groups is increasingly takeout and delivery driven.
> Eating at a restaurant seems like a subpar experience now compared to my own table.
Also most midrange restaurants I have been to lately are just so _loud_. Not sure if it is all the hard surfaces that are so popular, or if people just have less social awareness anymore and yap away at such high volumes.
Seems wild. I’d rather just make something at home, hit up a good food truck, or go somewhere fancy.
Look how many people wear headphones nowadays. Many of them at high volumes. Try to watch a movie and to listen to conversations in that movie. I am constantly using the remote to turn down loud explosions and amp up the very silent speakers. Its a problem of the studios and movie makers, not everybody has or wants a 7.1 sound system. The younger generation also is more short-sighted than ever. Smartphone and screen time is increasing. Also, loud music increases thirst, which is good for the owner. Another aspect is waking the fight mode in humans so the waiters are more vigilant after their night out the day before... Most of them are young uni students, earning some cash for partying.
hit up a good food truck, or go somewhere fancy.
I agree it seems the whole middle part of the of restaurant market is terrible. I can think of several places where I'm happy to pay $15-20 for a meal and several places where I'm happy to pay $100+, but hardly anywhere in the $30-40 range where I feel I'm getting value for money.
It's also loud because everyone is playing sound out of their device speakers, especially young parents who set up mini tablet theaters as soon as they sit down at the table. I don't understand why restaurants allow it. Why would I pay more for that ambiance?
All of the above. Most importantly, restaurant owners associate quiet with old and dead restaurants so they deliberately make things loud. They play music at loud levels which requires people to raise their voice. They prefer the look of hard surfaces and its certainly cheaper to leave wood, brick, and concrete exposed than to cover them up with material. Tablecloths impose ongoing costs and may not be in line with the ambiance the owners are going for.
For the restaurants mentioned in the article, I fully agree. Especially because you're not losing much quality. A pizza hut pizza will be just as bad at a pizza hut as it will be 15 minutes later at home or in a park. The same goes for the mostly deep fried or microwaved food at Applebee's or a Wing Joint.
But I will still opt to eat in at nicer establishments, where I'm paying for quality and don't want to suffer any lose of it. A nice plus is they usually have a nice atmosphere and a selection of cocktails/cocktails that I wouldn't make at home.
So we are talking about cheap chains, not middle class places. These are just slightly glorified fast food. In Europe, apart from TGI Fridays, they were never a thing. And they were seen as just simply fast food. If they vanished, few people will mention. If these are middle class they are for well, "statistical middle", i.e. working poor.
Proper restaurants should be small businesses and family owned and grow their client base over generations, then they are pretty much bulletproof against all kinds of economic hardships.
> These are just slightly glorified fast food
A lot of them have started to directly compete against fast food. Applebees for instance offers a deal that's about the same price as a McDonalds meal.
> In Europe, apart from TGI Fridays, they were never a thing. And they were seen as just simply fast food.
The discussion and the article is US specific, but as general point 'Europe' is a big generalization akin to 'Africa' or 'Asia'.
These places are too heterogenous for blanket statements.
As a point of anecdata between around the 1960's and early 2000's in most mediterranean countries, middle class would indeed sit down for lunch in nearby restaurants for an affordable lunch. Many of these places would serves as cafes during the day and affordable bistro at lunch.
Most either ramped up prices or went bust.
It is either grab a coffee and go or white cloth restaurant prices. The middle ground business model has indeed vanished or really downgraded their offering, in most countries around the mediterranean.
In Europe, apart from TGI Fridays, they were never a thing. And they were seen as just simply fast food.
I remember when the first TGI Fridays opened in my country (early 90s) and it was definitely seen as a pretty fancy 'foreign' restaurant, the sort of place you could definitely fo for special occasions or to celebrate something.
I think the difference is that Americans expect to be able to eat out several days a week. This means that an American middle-class restaurant must be cheaper than a European middle-class restaurant, which you go to once a month.
yeah, having grown up outside the US I kept wondering why exactly there aren't local, independent restaurants in that price point. do the economics just not work out over here due to disproportionately higher rent and labour costs?
I think it depends where you are. When I worked in Boston, going to somewhere like Chinatown was common. No one I knew would have gone to a chain restaurant for lunch.
true in the SF bay area too, but reading the article made me think that was an aberration. maybe the mom and pop restaurants only survive in big cities. or maybe the article was just over focused on the chains and ignoring the smaller restaurants.
I think it depends. I live in basically an exurban area about 50 miles west of Boston. I'm not sure I'd say there are a huge number of places, but there is definitely a decent population of local midrange restaurants.
Certainly you get into a more geuinely rural area and your options of all sorts shrink.
My bet is it that's due to people's obsession with brands. They just see "noname" thing as inherently less valuable than a branded one, so family-owned places stay invisible, looked down upon.
> These are just slightly glorified fast food. In Europe,
In my opinion it's a drinking culture thing. These places also served alcohol which is more tightly distributed than it would be in Europe. There's less of a reason for them to exist there.
I also think that's the reason for their decline. The day drinking crowd simply aged out of the business lunch segment. It was inevitable. COVID probably accelerated it some but the writing was on the wall.
> Proper restaurants
Yea, which is why I think it's about the drinks, these restaurants all used a common major supplier (Sysco) that makes restaurant ready foods that are mostly just microwave and serve. It was never about the quality of the food.
Indeed, in Europe it's totally normal to drink during the day, or well, near constantly. Probably a lot more so than in the US.
Indeed, in Europe...
In some parts of Europe. In other parts it is very much frowned upon. Then there is the generational shift, even in countries where it used to be the norm to drink at lunch, people under 30-40 just aren't drinking like that any more, and might very well frown upon people that do.
It used to be more common in the US. The “two martini lunch” was a staple. Today, I can’t remember the last time I had alcohol at lunch in a work setting.
I think that's changed over recent decades, millennials and later seem much more health conscious than previous generations.
Why? Their lives seem to be also a lot more useless than those of previous generations. Why care about them and not allow oneself little pleasures? As if some great achievements were waiting for them with only booze getting in the way.
Is it just simply because they are a lot more neurotic because of all that shit on the internet?